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Misanet.com / IRIN, 23 November - Somalia's newly appointed Prime Minister Ali Khalif Galeyr is in Nairobi for the first official meeting with Kenyan President Daniel arap Moi. The Somali parliament, elected in peace talks hosted in Djibouti, Arta, in August, gave the necessary vote of confidence for Galeyr's appointment on 9 November. He was interviewed in Nairobi.
QUESTION: Why are you in Kenya? ANSWER: We are in Kenya for two main reasons. One is to reestablish contacts with the Kenya government. We also wanted to thank the president for his involvement in the Somali issue, the search for peace for Somalis - and for hosting the very large number of Somali refugees. There are also all those who use Kenya as a transit point. We want to establish relations and an embassy here, and ask the Kenyan government to open an embassy in Mogadishu. President Daniel arap Moi, as an elder statesman, has a role to play in our peace building efforts and also in Somalia coming back to the regional organisations, IGAD (Intergovernmental Authority on Development), and the OAU (Organisation of African Unity). We succeeded in taking part in the last UN General Assembly , and the UN Millennium Summit, the Arab League and the Organisation of Islamic Congress. What is remaining is to complete that circle, and to participate in all these forums to occupy our rightful place among the international community ... Q: There were issues of recognition by the Kenyan government which recently hosted faction leaders opposed to you. Has that been clarified now? A: I don't think Somalia as a state needs recognition - the regime collapsed, the administration vaporised, and no-one since, has recognised Somaliland and Puntland. As far as the recognition or acceptance of the Somali government - what the United Nations and the Security Council has been saying about Somalia is testimony to our status. President Moi was very open about this. We still have to engage some of the individuals, groups and entities that did not take part in the Arta peace process - but as far as we are concerned, the Somalia state and this government is recognised and accepted. And that is certainly the impression I got when I met President Moi this morning.
Q: And the issue of Somali passports which have been illegally issued over the last 10 years? A: We have a proposal which was tabled in the council of ministers. We are about to finalise that, and the technical specifications, and make sure from the point of view of security they will not be easily forged. Whether it is the passport or the new currency, we want to make sure that we do have the real thing and there will be no more potential for misuse. Hopefully, we'll do both of these before the end of the year. Q: If you start talking about taking control of passports and currency, you are taking about the status of the "self-declared" regions of Somaliland and Puntland. A: As far as I know Puntland is using the old notes ... but we will leave this to market forces. There is going to be a market economy. We were not just going to drop truck loads of these new notes on anybody. We want to make sure the establishment of the central bank and other banking institutions are in place. The economy is very much integrated - the bulk of Somali livestock goes through Berbera in Somaliland - after leaving from Gedo in the south and from other parts of the country. The bulk of commodities come into Berbera (from the Gulf States) and then goes all the way to the central regions. I think good money will eventually drive out bad money. Q: What about Somaliland passports? A: As far as we know this is a new venture they have come up with. We will leave it up to the international community. There is a unified Somali state, and a central role is to come up with passports and banknotes. In terms of the international community, nobody - as far as I know - has officially recognised Somaliland so I don't know where these passports are going to be used. Or which countries people holding these Somaliland passports are going to get visas for. We don't really want to create any confrontation over this issue, but we will have our say in it. We will establish what is a passport from the Somali government - and the international community knows that Somalia is represented by one entity, not multiple entities.
Q: There is a feeling that by now, there should have been some progress in talks with Somaliland. Any behind-the-scene developments? A: I would be less than honest if I tell you that there are serious talks going on now. Our position is that we want to be very tolerant. We know why Somaliland came about. I participated myself in the Burao meeting of 1991 and of 1993 (which first formed the breakaway state, and later elected "President" Mohamed Egal). Most of the people in the cabinet and the Somaliland president are friends of mine. I come from the area. I know the rationale behind the formation of Somaliland when the state collapsed. But I think the dynamics and the whole political map has changed. We have not started a serious dialogue yet, but we are ready to engage them at any level they are happy with - whether at the highest level, or some informal arrangement. But I am sorry, thus far, apart from one or two lines of communication that have been established, we don't have anything concrete in hand. Q: What lines of communication? Phone calls? A: No, we haven't got to direct phoning - but we have used some of the diplomatic community to deliver messages. And we have received messages from Mr Egal. We have also had contacts with counsel elders and some of the cabinet members. But frankly this has not taken shape, not yet. This government was only given a vote of confidence 10 days ago so its too early in the game. We want to play a political game and agree on the rules of that game. We want to say, up front, we want to be tolerant. We want peaceful dialogue and we want to accommodate whatever is going to be the pattern of the discussions. Q: And has there been any progress with any of the Mogadishu faction leaders? A: Yes, I think we have made some progress with some of the faction leaders ... Q: Who? A: (laughs) I can't talk about them at this stage. But we made some substantial progress with some of them. The president is now in Yemen. Some of the faction leaders are in Yemen. Abdullahi Yusuf, leader of Puntland, is expected to arrive there ... and Yemen President Ali Abdullaha Saleh is having discussions with them. He is playing the role of mediator and making sure that at least there is some forum, or a basis for discussion. But ... we are confident that the Arta process [the Djibouti-hosted talks which elected the new government] has come up with an outcome which can be the basis of discussions. We do not want to restart that whole thing again, from point zero. Everything else is negotiable, but what is not negotiable is to go back to Arta or any other place and say we have to redraft a constitution, we have to create another parliament, or we have to elect a president. I think those, as far as we are concerned, are the facts on the ground. We don't want to revisit that.
Q: The talks with Ethiopia last week must have been crucial in respect to the opposition - what did they focus on? A: The talks went very well. It was a very good beginning. We share a lot with Ethiopia - good and bad. The president had very productive discussions with Ethiopian Prime Minister Meles Zenawi. And our delegation also had very productive discussions ... the spirit of the talks was very positive. I think a very serious beginning in establishing contacts and establishing embassies in the two capitals and forming joint commissions. We are in the process of opening an embassy in Addis Ababa. Q: And Ethiopian troops out of southern Somalia? A: Well, troops out of the south - (hesitates) - we hear that the troops are out of the south already. This is what we have been told. Q: Did you get an official assurance of that? A: Well, we are told that these troops are out. As to assurance, I cannot exactly say that. But I am telling you what has been reported from Gedo (southern Somalia) because that's where the Ethiopian troops were supposedly. Places like Luq, Dolo, and Bulahow. There's a border there, and in terms of Dolo the Ethiopians can be on their side. But in a place like Luq, which is almost 90 kms from the Ethiopian side, there was no reason for the Ethiopian forces to be there. The old canard of Islamic fundamentalists I think that is definitely - well, I think the Ethiopians got all the reassurances they want. And the Ethiopians know more about Mogadishu and these places than a good number of Somalis! They have their own people and if they want facts and if they want something real, I think they know the situation, and that's what the president told them. I mean, they were reassured. But to come back to your question: it was a very productive meeting and we're looking forward to moving on. A lot has to be done. Q: In terms of the expectations of this new government in Somalia, isn't it a problem that you've not yet even managed to touch areas where you do have support?
A: We haven't managed for one simple reason. The government is new, with the vote of confidence only taken on 7 November, and we have a lot to do in Mogadishu before we go anywhere else...The bulk of the country, whether it is south of Mogadishu, central regions - even places in Somaliland and Puntland - are asking us to send delegations. And we will send delegations to these places as soon as possible. Q: There have been two assassinations of government members already. Doesn't that show how impotent the government is? A: I think if anybody wants to assassinate somebody in London they can do it...if somebody wants to assassinate a political figure in Kenya, they can do it. Mogadishu is no different than a major metropolitan area in that sense ... We are almost certain that some of these so-called warlords are behind these assassinations. I think the issue will no longer be that they are somebody who wants to participate in the political arena; rather, it becomes purely an issue of thugs, and assassins, and terrorists. If that's the role they want to play, let them. The international community will see them for what they are worth, and who they are. They will show their true colours. What are we going to do about this? Well, we'll take some measures. We thought most people would have a level of sanity and would not engage in these kind of activities. We know some of the individuals involved in the assassinations have left the country - in the case of the general who was assassinated. We will do everything possible - because as long as they are in the Somali state we know they can run, but they cannot hide.
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Q: When the previous government collapsed, some embassies were abandoned, some taken over, and some personnel simply continued - how is the new government dealing with this?